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Aviation Forum / Country Specific / Australian Group / October 2007Fun stuff to try
Does anyone want to sit within sight of airport security, turn on their laptop, then visit this link? http://www.thecleverest.com/countdown.swf  SignatureKwyj. > Does anyone want to sit within sight of airport security, turn on their > laptop, then visit this link? > http://www.thecleverest.com/countdown.swf Yair - good way to get shot:-) Me and the Missus were returning to Oz after attending pistol shooting competitions in Finland and UK with 2 large suitcases of pistols. Heathrow was being patrolled by pairs of coppers with submachine guns. The checkin 'droid wanted us to open the suitcases so he could inspect the pistols (even though BA already had full details of them on his computer screen). I refused, insisting that if the cases were going to be opened it was going to be on HIS side of the counter. You could hardly blame a copper on anti-terrorism patrol for opening fire if he saw a customer starting to stand up with a pistol in his hand! Anyway, he insisted on seeing 'em so the cases were opened on his side of the counter - before he charged us £200 excess baggage which BA refunded in due course after I'd written them a blistering letter on our arrival home :-) "RT" <notr.thomas@nowhere.com.au> said: >Me and the Missus were returning to Oz after attending pistol shooting >competitions in Finland and UK with 2 large suitcases of pistols. Heathrow [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >excess baggage which BA refunded in due course after I'd written them a >blistering letter on our arrival home :-) I've had similar with Qantas and Virgin in Oz, where some counter jockeys have wanted to take one of my guns out of its case and have a good look at it. This usually involves him pointing it at me, then him looking down its barrel. My reaction now is similar to yours: 1) No. 2) On *your* side of the counter, away from public sight. 3) *I* will take the gun out of its container, show it to you (safely) , and then *I* will re-pack it. SignatureCraig http://www.wazu.jp/ 1,239 Unicode fonts for 82 written language groups: Price your own web plan: http://www.wazu.jp/hosting/ >Yair - good way to get shot:-) > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >excess baggage which BA refunded in due course after I'd written them a >blistering letter on our arrival home :-) Not as bad as my case at a prominent airport in SEA - they removed the weapons from check in luggage - I was told I had to take them by hand and hand them in when I was boarding! I objected strongly at the sanity of this course of action, but they insisted. So I put them in my carry on and went into the passenger only section for a couple of hours. I then explained the situation to the (soon to be) rather surprised Police at the pre-boarding screening, so that there were no surprises. Weapons put into a red bag, and retrieved from customs at the other end - after customs clearance. I was totally flabbergasted, and unlike British airports, the sub-machine guns were real. (the ones you saw were a special self-loading carbine for British police, it looks the part, but has no automatic fire capability). SignatureCheers Paul Saccani Perth, Western Australia. > unlike British airports, the > sub-machine guns were real. As a matter of interest, how could you tell? GB Signature"Most police misconduct occurs when citizens challenge an individual officer's authority" (Reiss, 1971 c.in Jermier & Berkes 1979) >> unlike British airports, the >> sub-machine guns were real. > > As a matter of interest, how could you tell? The trigger group is a visual give away. Describing the detail differences between an MP5SFA2/3 (British Police versions) and a HK94 would take quite some time. The detail differences with the MP5A2/3, beyond the trigger group are trivial - one can even use an SEF trigger group in them, unlike the case of the HK94. Beyond that - I was already familiar with what was used by Police in the respective countries. By the way, Australian state police forces usually use select fire weapons, not self loading look a likes. This (I suggest) is a by-product of the ban on self loading rifles. It is now not merely just as easy for them to get select fire weapons, it is now easier to do that than to get self loaders. SignatureCheers Paul Saccani Perth, Western Australia. >>> unlike British airports, the >>> sub-machine guns were real. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Beyond that - I was already familiar with what was used by Police in > the respective countries. Mmm - this was 27 (I think) years ago - was the HK94 about then? Not that I give a damn :-) Being shot once is more than enough :-) > By the way, Australian state police forces usually use select fire > weapons, not self loading look a likes. This (I suggest) is a > by-product of the ban on self loading rifles. It is now not merely > just as easy for them to get select fire weapons, it is now easier to > do that than to get self loaders. There was a 3-shot burst fire H&K pistol trialled by the local version of the SWAT squad when it existed. Be useful in a crowded elevator (you probably know that quote :-) but that's all. The cyclic rate is/was too high - climbed uncontrollably, even with a firm 2-handed grip. At that time they were using select fire smgs and used an old house on our pistol range for live fire and gas training. Dunno whether it was acoustic fatigue or the CS, but there were surprisingly few spiders in that derelict house :-) Us purists use a P9S in 9mm. In recent correspondence with H&K they said those pistols had been subjected to a 5,000 round acceptance test which was more than double the accepted norm at that time. They were subsequently used as the carry pistol by the German police. My correspondence with H&K was because the frame of my P9S had developed a minor crack after 90,000 rounds........ (Oi, you lot - stop yer whinging! Pistol bullets fly through the air - and a damn sight slower than I've travelled thru the air so of course we're on charter as far as the newsgroup goes!) >>>> unlike British airports, the >>>> sub-machine guns were real. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Mmm - this was 27 (I think) years ago - was the HK94 about then? 1983 - but the UK Police use the MP5SFA2/3 (in case that was not clear). >There was a 3-shot burst fire H&K pistol trialled by the local version of >the SWAT squad when it existed. Be useful in a crowded elevator (you >probably know that quote :-) but that's all. The cyclic rate is/was too >high - climbed uncontrollably, even with a firm 2-handed grip. Hmm - Glocks are probably lighter, and have a high cyclic rate, but trained operators can get all the shots in a figure 11 at 25 m. Surprised me. >At that time they were using select fire smgs and used an old house on our >pistol range for live fire and gas training. Dunno whether it was acoustic >fatigue or the CS, but there were surprisingly few spiders in that derelict >house :-) Sounds like a plan... >Us purists use a P9S in 9mm. In recent correspondence with H&K they said >those pistols had been subjected to a 5,000 round acceptance test which was >more than double the accepted norm at that time. They were subsequently >used as the carry pistol by the German police. I thought that was what they were developed for? > My correspondence with H&K >was because the frame of my P9S had developed a minor crack after 90,000 >rounds........ I've heard that there are training issue Glock 17s which have done in excess of a million rounds without need of repair. SignatureCheers Paul Saccani Perth, Western Australia. >>>>> unlike British airports, the >>>>> sub-machine guns were real. [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > I've heard that there are training issue Glock 17s which have done in > excess of a million rounds without need of repair. There you are you see. Even worse over-design than the P9S. A good design would see all examples fail at 5001 rounds........... >There you are you see. Even worse over-design than the P9S. A good >design would see all examples fail at 5001 rounds........... That can be done with a Glock, if necessary (user authentication trigger group). ;) There doesn't seem to be a high market demand for this "feature". SignatureCheers Paul Saccani Perth, Western Australia. >>>> unlike British airports, the >>>> sub-machine guns were real. [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] >and a damn sight slower than I've travelled thru the air so of course we're >on charter as far as the newsgroup goes!) Did I see somewhere that you were at a shooting comp in Europe recently? Are you going to (or at) the Oceanic thing at ISSC this week? Must look the results for your name.. :-) Just to keep on track: I have not calculated how fast pistol bullets go versus the Jabiru. Slinging a couple of Pardinis under the wings aint guna do much good anyhow with only 5 shots per mag... :-) The :-) is to show I am joking. > >>>> unlike British airports, the > >>>> sub-machine guns were real. [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] > > The :-) is to show I am joking. Hmm quick shot Jatos eh :-) > Did I see somewhere that you were at a shooting comp in Europe > recently? No - haven't travelled to shoot for years now - my pension is creeping up so I just shoot for fun rather than competitively :-) In the (hectic) good ole daze I've shot in Finland, Holland, US and Germany and been to a couple of Pistol ADs at Bisley. Those Bisley shoots were unbelievable - huge trade displays, bazillions of different matches - schmick the duck. Then the stupid Pom gummint went and ruined it... > Are you going to (or at) the Oceanic thing at ISSC this week? > > Must look the results for your name.. :-) See above - too old and lazy now <yawn> Even to the extent I'm considering selling my "spare" pistols - such as the S&W Mod 52 with 4 6-shot mags - was set up for Service Pistol. > Just to keep on track: > > I have not calculated how fast pistol bullets go versus the Jabiru. Hmph - 820 fps for a hollow base wadcutter in .38 = 485 kt > Slinging a couple of Pardinis under the wings aint guna do much good > anyhow with only 5 shots per mag... :-) > The :-) is to show I am joking. Mmmmm - ok. But the mere suggestion of anyone hanging a spaghetti gun orf an Oz a/c... A coupla Owens is what you need - good for roos and rabbits. >Mmmmm - ok. But the mere suggestion of anyone hanging a spaghetti gun orf >an Oz a/c... > >A coupla Owens is what you need - good for roos and rabbits. About 15 years ago a chap down here was building hours towards an ag job- he was employed to fly an ultralight fitted with a shotgun over an almond orchard scaring the nasty almond-eating birdies away. Next door neighbour took exception when peppered with some shot and mentioned this system to the local CASA folk. Employer and pilot were duly prosecuted on the grounds that in Oz, the RAAF reserves the right to have guns fixed to aircraft...... Saw him again recently, he got a bit of a fine and a slap on the wrist. He said that as he was leaving the court, he noticed a wry smile on the face of the magistrate, who was an older chap, possibly of WWII vintage..... Coop > About 15 years ago a chap down here was building hours towards an ag > job- he was employed to fly an ultralight fitted with a shotgun over [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > smile on the face of the magistrate, who was an older chap, possibly > of WWII vintage..... Heh - good one :-) Paul Saccani wrote... > > As a matter of interest, how could you tell? > > The trigger group is a visual give away. Describing the detail > differences between an MP5SFA2/3 (British Police versions) and a HK94 Are they anything like the BFG5000 or the Devastator? SignatureDon't bet on a horse that's called "Tarzan's Grip"... "Marts" <marts_57@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message > Don't bet on a horse that's called "Tarzan's Grip"... 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