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Aviation Forum / General / IFR / September 2008Pattern for IFR
Would you ever be directed into the traffic pattern while approaching an airport for landing IFR? That is, would you be told to make right/left downwind or right/left traffic for landing? If so, what's the procedure? I was under the impression that, if you are IFR, you will be given specific instructions up until you actually have the field in sight, which means that, if you are truly to enter the pattern, ATC would first verify that you have the field in sight, then say something like "cleared for the visual approach" (?). I guess I'm confused about the conditions under which you'd be left up to your own discretion for altitude and heading under IFR during an approach. > Would you ever be directed into the traffic pattern while approaching an > airport for landing IFR? That is, would you be told to make right/left [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > I guess I'm confused about the conditions under which you'd be left up to your > own discretion for altitude and heading under IFR during an approach. Uncontrolled fields are "uncontrolled". You'd be cleared for the approach (instrument or visual (or contact I suppose), and then told you were free to use the advisory frequency. Approach/Center controllers wouldn't care what pattern entry (downwind/base/final) you would use or anything else. 9 times out of 10 (with vectoring) its been a straight in approach for whatever airport im heading for based on surface winds etc. I've never gotten an "enter left downind". Some VATSIM controller tell you how to enter the pattern? ;-) Now a controlled field will tell you how to enter their pattern in accordance with whatever's going on. All that being said, its best to use the pattern appropriate for an airport to avoid running into VFR traffic. Just because you are on an IFR flight plan doesn't mean that you can ignore the VFR traffic around you. Brian N9093K > Uncontrolled fields are "uncontrolled". You'd be cleared for the > approach (instrument or visual (or contact I suppose), and then told > you were free to use the advisory frequency. Approach/Center > controllers wouldn't care what pattern entry (downwind/base/final) you > would use or anything else. This was a Class B, though. And yes, it was on VATSIM, with a trainee controller. I was simply told to make right traffic as I entered the Bravo at 8000 (field elevation 1800). In the past I've always been given vectors and altitudes until I confirm that I have the field in sight, at which point I'm cleared for a visual approach (without any mention of pattern). It seemed odd that I'd be cut loose for the approach in a pattern in Bravo airspace, while still at 8000. But I didn't really know if the controller was doing something wrong or if this was just something new that I hadn't experienced before while IFR. > 9 times out of 10 (with vectoring) its been a straight in approach for > whatever airport im heading for based on surface winds etc. I've never > gotten an "enter left downind". > > Some VATSIM controller tell you how to enter the pattern? ;-) Yup. > Now a controlled field will tell you how to enter their pattern in > accordance with whatever's going on. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > IFR flight plan doesn't mean that you can ignore the VFR traffic > around you. I've been cleared for a visual approach (said exactly that way "cleared for the visual approach") in the past after being descended to a few thousand feet above the field and while moving roughly in a downwind pattern, but only after I've confirmed that I have the field in sight. So this procedure mystified me. > I've been cleared for a visual approach (said exactly that way "cleared for > the visual approach") in the past after being descended to a few thousand feet > above the field and while moving roughly in a downwind pattern, but only after > I've confirmed that I have the field in sight. So this procedure mystified > me. How did you do that when you don't have a airman's certificate? ...some flight simulator game? >> I've been cleared for a visual approach (said exactly that way >> "cleared for the visual approach") in the past after being descended [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > How did you do that when you don't have a airman's certificate? > ...some flight simulator game? Anthony only flies MSFS and uses VATSIM. He has deluded himself into thinking he is a pilot from his vast experience with those games. >>>I've been cleared for a visual approach (said exactly that way >>>"cleared for the visual approach") in the past after being descended [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Anthony only flies MSFS and uses VATSIM. He has deluded himself into > thinking he is a pilot from his vast experience with those games. He probably knows all about thunderstorm avoidance, too. And, icy winter runways, etc, and ad nasueum. Maybe he can tell us all about his RNP SAAAR (excuese me, "SA" in ICAO-speak) qualifications and vast operating experience. > Maybe he can tell us all about his RNP SAAAR (excuese me, "SA" in > ICAO-speak) qualifications and vast operating experience. It's actually "AR" in ICAO-speak! There's a distinction between being "IFR" and "IMC". IFR just means you're flying under controller direction for separation purposes. If the field is visual but with low clouds, you'll usually get a straight in approach, but if that lines up with a downwind runway, ATC may authorize a "circle to land" approach. Once you're flying visually, you have to fit into the ongoing pattern. If the field is controlled, that means tower direction and you typically call tower 5 miles out. If the field is uncontrolled, you call the local CTAF when ATC turns you loose to do that and then if the field is under VFR rules you have to fit into the existing traffic flow. > There's a distinction between being "IFR" and "IMC". > > IFR just means you're flying under controller direction for separation > purposes. IFR means you're flying under Instrument Flight Rules, you can do that in IMC in Class G airspace without controller direction for separation purposes. |
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